What horse power tractor do I need?

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Sun, 08/12/2012 - 15:51 #1

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supremo
Last seen: 03/08/2018 - 21:05
Joined: 08/12/2012 - 15:41

What horse power tractor do I need?

Hi I am new as new can be, I have a 40 acre property most is tractorable but hilly in the latrobe regions of victoria where it is very wet and clayie. i want to grow some hay for the cows. what will I need for the job do I need 4x4 without ? or can I get away with 2 wheel drive. cheers for any help. thx

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Sun, 08/12/2012 - 16:01 #2
Farmed-Out
Last seen: 05/27/2013 - 10:55
Joined: 03/12/2012 - 09:44

Not sure what you call hilly in this region but some of our paddocks even the mountain goats refuse to traverse and we wouldn't be without 4wd.

Our 67 IH isn't 4wd but that really has limited uses these days but the other 3 tractors are all 4wd and around 85HP. We cart 3 large round bails on the Kubota and the Fiat (both with Burder front lifts) and cart them anything up to 12 ks on the road or up and down the paddocks. For the sake of piece of mind I'd always choose 4wd for the areas in Gippsland but also bare in mind 4wd isn't always a saviour. We've had the Kubota bogged up to the diffs, we've had spots where the tractors have refused to go and I've even had the Kubota sliding sideway with two bails on it down a hill.

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Sun, 08/12/2012 - 16:21 #3
supremo
Last seen: 03/08/2018 - 21:05
Joined: 08/12/2012 - 15:41

Hi farmed out - thx for the input. ..i remember on building sites there would be a few contactors with 4x4s tractor with a load of 1.2 ton of bricks and compain how he cannot get them on the jobs its too muddy then the same day another driver who I got to know really well hed come on the job with his old 2 wheel case tractor and move them where I wanted with amazing driving easy.I asked why he just said its the tractors centre of ballance to weight?Can I ask are all  4x4 always better than a 2 wheel tractor. Or could I get away with a 2 wheel to only using the flatter paddocks during the winter months. do you use all your paddocks during winter or do you leave them in 1 paddock then dry feed them till it springs up a bit. do you grow hay farmedout?as i said i am new. cheers

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Sun, 08/12/2012 - 17:02 #4
Farmed-Out
Last seen: 05/27/2013 - 10:55
Joined: 03/12/2012 - 09:44

Driving a tractor to some places is as much about the driver as it is the tractor. There is places on our farms that I wont drive a tractor or 4wd but one of the other guys will. He drives the tractor straight through any mud he finds going by the theory that the straight route is always the best route, where as I go by the theory that going through the same mud patch 15 times a day just makes the mud patch deeper, where as going around it or through it at different spots allowing the tyres to cut a new track each time may mean wider patches but those patches repair quicker.

4wd isn't automatically better than 2wd but the reason I'd go 4wd in this area is because our hills (and currently our sopping wet paddocks) are much safer is traveresed in 4wd. When the grass is dewy or damp due to early morning moisture a hill that was safe in 2wd can easily become unsafe and 4wd gives you that added bit of stability. 4wd also gives you a little more help when pulling implements, for me the argument is that 4wd is always better but then I'm not paying your bills, you may have to justify the extra expense of 4wd. But consider what would happen if you thought you only wanted to use the flat paddocks for winter but a cow escaped into the hill paddock and you needed to get in there, or you had to repair something, with only 2wd you can't with 4wd you can atleast make the assessment as to whether it's safe.

Although this year in Gippy has been a tad different (about 40 inches different actually) even in the dryer years there have been plenty of flat paddocks that turn to mush quickly and with what seems like little rainfall. This year with over 40 inches of rain in 4 months even the flat paddocks are turning into swimming pools and there is hardly a farmer around who hasn't either had something pulled out of a bog or it's still sitting there. (A mate of ours has had his quad bike buried in the hill paddock now for 3 months because he can't get the tractor to it to pull it out).

We use every paddock we've got all year around except for the "no mans lands" we have which are too steep for cattle (and a risk of landfall) at all times of year. On one farm we keep the cattle out of two larger paddocks for hay in the later months (about now) on another we keep them off half the paddocks for hay but we give them the tree lined paddock which is very muddy so they can stay a bit warmer in the winter months on the newest farm until market day we've got too many cows on there to keep out of any paddock so we just rotate them around all 8 and on the farm we don't go to very often we give them free run on all but the two flat paddocks we use for hay. But on all farms the entire year they are rotated between paddocks to allow each paddock to feed and regnerate, we don't worry about winter we only worry about hay season.

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Sun, 08/12/2012 - 17:55 #5
supremo
Last seen: 03/08/2018 - 21:05
Joined: 08/12/2012 - 15:41

thx mate id go with 4x4 . so what sort of horse power do you think?.also how many large round bale would you use per average season as to head. how how many acre of hay do you need per bale. any help?cheers  thx for your time and  input

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Sun, 08/12/2012 - 18:20 #6
Farmed-Out
Last seen: 05/27/2013 - 10:55
Joined: 03/12/2012 - 09:44

Our to bigger ones are 85 and the Fiat is....umm I don't even remember the model but probably less than it was manufactured with :) but HP isn't everything it's all about what you plan to do with it vs what you can afford.

I'm not sure there is an average bail count. Last year we bailed about 250 bails and used most of them, this year we bailed about 280 hay and 160 silage (we did buy a new farm this year though). Currently we are having trouble keeping the feed up because it's so wet and cold the cows are eating so much. As a rough guide which could differ to all other farms on one farm we have about 130 animals separated into two herds and out paddocks are about 20 acres each, we are feeding out hay or silage every second day, but this time last year we were only feeding out twice a week.

As to the acreage for hay well that depends a bit too, we got 160 bails of silage off about 1/4 of our 130 acre farm and the 280 bails came from maybe 60 arces in total (it's a bit hard to guesstimate because they were on two different farms). You could try ringing a hay cutting company and ask them what they'd expect to get per acre, they'd probably have a better estimate if they knew the area.

 

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Sun, 08/12/2012 - 18:36 #7
supremo
Last seen: 03/08/2018 - 21:05
Joined: 08/12/2012 - 15:41

Thx farmed out is your farm a dairy or just cattle? do you sew seed for your hay or just let it grow. whats the diffence from sillage as to hay. so how many bale do you give out every second day to each group of cow. it has been a dirty winter. we have come over from the west and its the opposite over there winter you grow grass and summer its dead.well summer and most of autum he he he.

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Sun, 08/12/2012 - 18:59 #8
Farmed-Out
Last seen: 05/27/2013 - 10:55
Joined: 03/12/2012 - 09:44

All beef, some are breeders and some are sellers but it's all beef. We sow seed occasionally in the hay paddocks on one farm if they are a bit bare but gernally we just let them grow. Silage is cut green and packed and sealed green, hay is usually dried and wrapped jsut in open weave wrap, well that's what I believe is the difference, as to the benefits of one over the other I don't really know it's not really my area of the farms. We put out 1 bale for about 40 head, the numbers in each paddock/farm vary a little but it's about 40 head in each herd. Trust me this winter in LV is not normal, we spent several years in drought conidtions, several years getting less than 15 inches in an entire year, this year we've had several weeks, including during summer, where we've had 15 inches in a week.

 

 

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Sun, 08/12/2012 - 19:16 #9
supremo
Last seen: 03/08/2018 - 21:05
Joined: 08/12/2012 - 15:41

thx again for anwering my question. as for the weather in the LV its amzing how cow farts control the weather even if its raining cats and dogs..cheers

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Sun, 08/12/2012 - 19:20 #10
Farmed-Out
Last seen: 05/27/2013 - 10:55
Joined: 03/12/2012 - 09:44

Well when cows eat coal for so long they have to release something!!

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Sun, 08/12/2012 - 19:32 #11
supremo
Last seen: 03/08/2018 - 21:05
Joined: 08/12/2012 - 15:41

you told me they eat hay and sillage.Laughing.

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Sun, 08/12/2012 - 19:37 #12
Farmed-Out
Last seen: 05/27/2013 - 10:55
Joined: 03/12/2012 - 09:44

Sssshhh don't give away our secret

 

Although with coal stretching from Adelaide to New Zealand and more than enough to last 500 years if we can't burn it for power we have to do something with it so the cows may as well eat it :)

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Mon, 08/13/2012 - 12:45 #13
charlie
Last seen: 12/26/2018 - 09:21
Joined: 05/31/2011 - 09:44

Hi Supremo,

Sounds like you and Farmed Out have thing's sorted out. I will ad a few comments to your questions.

I grew up driving a two wheel drive tractor, when we moved to a four wheel drive tractor the difference was huge. The tractor we purchased had the option of either front wheel assist, where the front wheels engage if the rear ones start to slip or constant four wheel drive. A four wheel drive tractor will allow you to get into places and do jobs (when it is wet and slippery) that you wouldn't be able to do with a two wheel drive tractor. We have recently written an article on 'Choosing a small farm tractor' which you may find useful.      

In comparing hay to silage. There is always a balance when conserving fodder between high quality / low yield and low quality / high yield. The big difference between hay and silage is the dry matter content. Silage is usually 25-35% dry matter (weight of feed without the water) while hay is 80-90% dry matter. Silage is faster to make than hay (requires less drying time), is more expensive and requires highly specialised production and handling equipment.

The amount of hay or silage to feed out will depend on the size of the cattle, how long you need to feed them for and the percentage of the diet being fed. Cows will consume around 2.5% (2.5% x 500kg = 12.5kg/DM/day) of their body weight in dry matter each day. Let's assume that a large hay bale weighs 220kg (90% DM x 220kg), that's 198kg of dry matter. If you have 10 cows that you want to feed 100% of their diet for 30 days you will require 12.5kg x 30 days x 10 cows = 3750kg or 19 hay bales. You will need to ad some extra hay to these calculations to allow for wastage when the hay is fed out.

I hope this information is helpful.

Regards,

Charlie    

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Mon, 08/13/2012 - 13:31 #14
supremo
Last seen: 03/08/2018 - 21:05
Joined: 08/12/2012 - 15:41

Thx charlie. very helpful. how do you know how much hay is needed each day is it as easy as seeing they have little left . also do you allow 100 per cent of dry feed though they are eating little grass as well. also on average how  many days would one allow for a season ie days of dry feed say for 20 medium size cows.Rember i am a simple man explain in simple term as you have b4.10 cow sinario was good.cheers

Also what sort of horse power would you think id need or not to go below a H/P if i wanted to seed hay now and then and shift stuff for 30 cows on flate to undulating to some hills? cheers

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Mon, 08/13/2012 - 21:58 #15
Farmed-Out
Last seen: 05/27/2013 - 10:55
Joined: 03/12/2012 - 09:44

Horsepower depends on budget, you buy what you can afford and use it accordingly and within it's limits. Going by the hills I see around this area you could have 120HP and still not be able to access the entire farm and when it's muddy like it is now that 120HP may not even be able to get through the gate if the cows have chewwed it up. HP doesn't automatically make the tractor work on every farm, once again talk to the farmers around you they will be the best indication of what works and what doesn't for your area.

You need to also consider what tractor is able to handle, i.e. the implements you want to use, and once again HP may only be a small factor in which implements work and which don't. A front loader with a bucket is an absolute must on our farms which means we wouldn't consider a tractor that couldn't have atleast an XP2 Burder on the front good for about 800KG. A  post rammer is a must for us and while they have HP ratings it's equally important that the linakage on the back can handle the weight of the rammer.

That all may seem over detailed and long winded (and I probably could have gone on) but HP is such a small part of buying the right tractor that I think anyone willing to just throw up an answer based on moving a few bails around is not looking at the full picture.

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Tue, 08/14/2012 - 15:48 #16
supremo
Last seen: 03/08/2018 - 21:05
Joined: 08/12/2012 - 15:41

thx farmedout. any input - long winded is good if you have the time. cheers. any info for me is great as I am new to this, very new. Where i am getting trapped in my thinking is I know more about broad acre farming where I believe and have been told horsepower is important, for ripping etc. Ill be upfront i am new to the area we just moved from the west 3 months ago and have bought a property 40 ac which we receive in october.So i am getting ready getting the right info before i move ahead and buy stuff. We dont know anyone yet to talk to. i hope to talk to the owners and agent with my questions that i have gained on this forum as well as any more that i have missed in my head. There is loads of questions and vriable to the questions that need to answered or learned so any site or article that may be helpful is good .Probably most of what i need to learn is the property itself how the season works. how to use the  paddocks which one to use first and last . which ones and how long. Id like to keep about 7 sheep as well as the majority with cows. Though i have found most articles are written with the idea that the person knows what its all about and misses the mark of new to the game person.I do want to hoe a large veggie patch as  well as seed my pasture now and then but costs are a factor with us for now..Would something like this be any good?..Tractor is deisel 8 sp. gear box 4 sp. PTO. new rear tyres it's in good condition ower all. Drum moover 2 disc 6 blades cuting with 1.4 metres Kuhn rotary pull along hay rake Ford small squire hay bailer All this equipment was used last season and is available . (Tractor only $ 12.000,00) Equipment located in Drouin Victoria 3818 Ps. tractor does come with bucket. Shibaura 4x4 tractor with front loader SD3000 38 HP.??? Or am i buying a buckets of foriegn rubblish?cheers in advance. Cool

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Tue, 08/14/2012 - 15:47 #17
charlie
Last seen: 12/26/2018 - 09:21
Joined: 05/31/2011 - 09:44

Hi Supremo,

I would keep enough hay on hand to last at least 4 months of 100% feeding. That way you will have excess fodder stored if it sets in dry or if the winter is particularlly hard. During the winter you will probably want to supplement 25-50% of the diet, depending on the amount of feed on offer in the paddock and whether you want the cows to maintain or gain weight.

You will not be able to judge how much to feed them by how much they leave behind as most of the time cattle will eat everything you give them. If they have a choice, old, dead grass or lucerne hay, they will eat lucerne hay. Just like humans, if you have a choice of potatoes or ice cream, you will eat ice cream (maybe).

Lets assume that you want to supplement 50% of the cows diet with hay for 90 days (an average winter in your area). From our previous numbers, where each cow eats:
12.5kg/DM per day x 50% = 6.25kg/DM
6.25kg/DM x 90 days x 30 cows = 16,875kg/DM.
If each bale weighs 198kg/DM, that's 16,875kg/DM / 198kg = 85 bales. Add another 10% to this number for wastage = 93 bales.

Regarding the tractor horse power etc, I would firstly decide on the exact farm implements you need and then match the tractor to these implements. That way you are going to get a tractor that is a 'good fit', not too big or small for the implements and farming task.

Charlie

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Tue, 08/14/2012 - 18:57 #18
supremo
Last seen: 03/08/2018 - 21:05
Joined: 08/12/2012 - 15:41

thx charlie. What is hay mainly consist of , I have heard of oaten hay lucean hay. When i see hay bale lying around the paddock around here what are they made of. I havnt asked yet but is lucen grown around here is lucen and lucen hay the same. . or is it clover they sow around druoin or oaten hay or is it  just grass.

What sort of implaInnocentments do you think id need. old and small is ok for me but i dont know what make are right for me. what sort of things do i need or to look for. i dont really want a baler id like to see another farmer for that. but i am thinking a small ripping tool rotary hoe what type or brand i wouldnt have a clue finger rake bucket is a must with forks, somthing to cut the grass. id like the sickle bar cutter but they dont have those any more in australia. how do they sow oaten hay is it with a seed and super unit not sure. cheers for any help...Tongue out

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Wed, 08/15/2012 - 13:03 #19
charlie
Last seen: 12/26/2018 - 09:21
Joined: 05/31/2011 - 09:44

Hi Supremo,

It is difficult to say what type of hay it is. A lot of farmers make hay in the Spring - Summer out of what ever is growing in the paddock (could be a mix of grass and clover). Lucerne makes excellent quality hay, it is a perennial plant (lives for three years +) that can be cut multiple time during the season.

Because you only have a small area I would get a contractor to do any hay making and sowing. We have discussed a similar scenerio here

As for other implements, look at a basic slasher for keeping the farm tidy and reducing fire risk, a tractor with bucket / forks / blade. These implements will be a good starting point. 

Charlie

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Wed, 08/15/2012 - 13:19 #20
Farmed-Out
Last seen: 05/27/2013 - 10:55
Joined: 03/12/2012 - 09:44

Totally agree with getting in contractors for hay. As stated pervious we did over 400 bales (combined) last year and we still wouldn't consider buying all the gear and doing it ourselves. For the most part of the year the equipment sits around doing nothing and you end up using it for a few days a year but it's cost you a fortune to own. Simply easier to get the contractors in, they (well our guys) bring in 3 tractors at a time, cut, rake and wrap, and last time they did 160 odd bales in a bit more than an afternoon on varying angled ground and only lost one bale. Simply easier!

As for other implements to own, definitely a slasher, either chain or blade, forks and a bucket with a decent load capacity (governed by the size of the tractor too), rear forks or a bale roller depending on how you want to put the hay out, softhands if you plan on stacking your own silage bales if you use them because forks aren't good to spike new silage with, a sparyer that hangs on the 3 point linkage and makes spraying weeds easier, a seeder if you want to do your own seeding and a post rammer if you want to do your own fences rather than pay the pros to do it whom I hear charge about $15 per meter which really adds up on a 100 meters of 5 strand fence.

There is no doubt a multitude of other things you COULD hang on the tractor but it all comes down to practicality and money.

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Wed, 08/15/2012 - 15:04 #21
supremo
Last seen: 03/08/2018 - 21:05
Joined: 08/12/2012 - 15:41

Hi guys what the cost involved in getting a contractor in i notice in your senarios no figures where given things may sit around after use but thet stay the same with the little use. whats the real cost. you are right if you dont have the time then get a contracor in but I do i agree. also 2 get a contactor to do baling is fine.Can you tell me what things you use in seeding and cutting and baleing.

can you please give me a list please.i believe if you have the time do it yourself always you save every time without exception.with in a few short years you have things paid off .This is more a hobby for me and contacting is not cheep either?wages and profit is a big factor that I do know. I run a busness myself in the building trade I know if you have the time it will save cost and lots.  the secret is, stay small and not nessaryly  new. just practical and built to do the job. just need the right info. cheers.Smilecan you tell me whats the tool youll need.I am even thinking doing it the old fashion way hand shears. people today like gaggets and those gaggets today are over priced in my view.I could easy do 15 acres in a day doing it hand sickle. the cost 100 dollar sickle. In america nad europe they still use a 1200 dollar sickle bar that will fo small acreage in a few hours. just need some ideas  with the old school thinking to help me.is a seed and super unit use in sowing seed in cattle farming? if this is the case i  can get those things for next to nothing some people that I know on the erye pen will give them away they want 40 foot plus stuff today just need freight. some peoplke may think thgis is drakonoa but its not its do it yourself can do like the com bank ad CAN..Can you please tell me whats the cost for a contractor to do 15 - 20 acre i am thinking they wont charge hourly rate its the day to do a few hours here and there. whats the cost please.w did it cost you to do 400 bales?...

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Wed, 08/15/2012 - 17:15 #22
Farmed-Out
Last seen: 05/27/2013 - 10:55
Joined: 03/12/2012 - 09:44

Contracting costs will vary, I don't have the figures at hand as to how much we paid last year but for us it's just not worth owning the gear, because of the outlay and because we'd need storage sheds to keep them in their best conditions, we'd need to service them before use and then probably service them before storage to ensure while they were put away they stayed in good nick and then there is running costs. Just because you don't use something doesn't mean it doesn't age, seals weaken without use, oil (in most machinery) changes, even when stored in a shed the elements can be harsh to your equipment and simply pulling something out and expecting it to work because it did 12 months ago when it was put in there is quite unrealistic.

In many cases regular servicing of equipment in storage is a must and one of the reasons why we created Krafty Farm Assistant. Originally designed for farm owners who relied on farm hands to assist them we quickly realise there was a market for both those farm owners who work away from their farms and those who work on their farm to have an easy to use maintenance scheduling system, something to remind them when things need servicing, remind them what servicing needs doing and for them to keep track of what servicing has been done previously. Too often servicing and mainteance is overlooked on farms (and other workplaces) don;t let yours be one of them :)

For no other reason that they came up in a search check out

Baler

Wrapper

Rake

By no means am I suggesting that's what you need but those three items alone are $30K, that's alot of money to have sitting around and only used once a year. Also bear in mind that while second hand equipment is viable you need to factor in breakdown costs and replacement of parts, both of which Murphy's law states will happen 5 minutes before you need to use them and 10 minutes before it's going to rain and make all your cut hay too soggy to pick up. Obviously you need to do your sums to find out what you can and can't afford but for many small farm owers owning their own baling equipment is just not worth it because $30k can buy a lot of other useful and practical things.

While I agree that in todays world many things are overpriced and not necessary if you are seriously thinking that you can use a sickle to do 15-20 acres just to save yourself some money you are going to be doing farming the hard way. Sure the implements you buy will cost you money but a slasher which cuts grass for feed, cuts grass for fire breaks, cuts grass in the areas you're cattle aren't as well as other things can be picked up for maybe $2500 for a decent second hand one, a baler, wrapper and rake is 10 times that price and does one job only.

A quick search on Google brought up this site hay prices which quotes South Gippy prices for the 2010-2011 season. You are going to have to do your own maths and maybe a bit of research but considering they are suggesting about $120 per hour for raking then a per bale cost and 20 acres will only take them a few hours to do it the outlay of expensive balers, wrappers and rakes might just seem a little extravagent even in a 10 year plan.

At the risk of offending I really think you need to do a lot more research, into farming the dirt you have, into what is needed, into the costs associated and into how right you are for the job. Those farmers around you will give you the best indication of what is possible, what is practical and what costs they incur doing it. Forums are great for advice but they can only give so much information and many of the questions you are bringing up are best answered by a local.

 

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Thu, 08/16/2012 - 09:08 #23
supremo
Last seen: 03/08/2018 - 21:05
Joined: 08/12/2012 - 15:41

thx again farmed out. i am not sure if you read my previous post properly , probably my typing and spelling, but the baler for big bales I agree is on the expensive side to buy outright i would get a contractor to do that part, hopefully my neighboure will have one.. but did you see my post on a guy selling some indian or china made 4x4 38hp tractor with bucket with a rake and baler (small bales) all for 14,000. maybe for your farm those items you showed to me to be on the big size.

Also those matanance issue you highlighted they are  their for the contractor too and he passes it on to the customer(but over many) as well as braking down on the job. thing will happen on any farm as well as the contractor for you a contractor works for you when you have that many cows as you have, and paddocks to run over as well as 2 farms thats fine i see that for you. but a smaller one like mine (ithink) is managable. but the best thing , with things that brake down once you fix them once, you know what to do the next time. i know alot of broad acer farmers the off season is matainace time the same in cattle id think winter is prepare time the things you need. i will take everthing on board and keep asking my dumb question till it make sence for me.hard work is never far from me thats the way i am built. some say nuts but other maybe kinder. any way cheers

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Thu, 08/16/2012 - 11:25 #24
Farmed-Out
Last seen: 05/27/2013 - 10:55
Joined: 03/12/2012 - 09:44

To be honest I don't know any farmer on small acerage (less than 500 acres) who owns a baler, they all just pay contractors because it's easier, quicker and more cost effectrive in the long term, but I don't know every farmer so I'm sure someone is buying these things and doing it themselves.

As far as the chinese and indian tractors go it's like anything newish to the market, they possibly are a risk but as to whether that risk pays off is a little bit in the lap of the gods. Great Wall vehicles have copped a massive canning on most forums since they were released but the Chinese have been driving them for years, they are built from the technology cars on our roads used less than 10 years ago and in Russia the Great Wall 4wd scene actually rivals Toyotas and some of the things the owners do put Toyotas to shame. Shibaura is actually a Japanese brand that has been around since the 50's, as to how reliable they are in this country both on the farm and in the workshop is something I can't answer, they don't look like cheap imported garbage but every company can make a lemon even the big boys so buying on looks isn't advisable either. The one thing I will say though is that 38HP while not useless may well be underpowered when it comes to using a bucket. Sure you might be able to pick up a bucket's safe loaded weight (bucket weights are usually matched to the tractor) but actually digging with it will be a different story and you'll lift the front end before you dig a decent weight, even our 85HP Kubota takes very little off even soft ground without raising the wheels. (driving ability also dictates how well buckets work but the power of the tractor is worth considering). I'd definitely be checking out the manufacturers spec sheets for what can and can't be connected to a tractor like that before I purchased.

I don't know what your budget for a new tractor is but a quick search reveals you can buy brand new tractors in the 50HP range with a bucket and cabin for less than $30K from Melbourne considering they would come with a warranty and more than likely not come with the previous owners issues (if that's why they sold it) buying new might be more benefical in the long run rather than buying second hand.

Sure a contractor passes on his maintenance costs to the end user but it's not like he charges $100 per hour today, then charges $120 per hour tomorrow because he needed his tractor serviced and if any contractor charges you a fee because his tractor breaks down on your propety he'd run out of business really quick. Unless your property is specifically to blame, i.e. you left a heap of fencing wire in the long grass and it damaged his mower, you are not responsible for his repairs and if he's quoted you for the job you have no obligation to pay him.

In actual fact it's 7 farms but we don't get a contractor to do hay because of the size we get them because it saves us either time, money or both because while we aren't maintaining, storing and paying off once a year items we are free to do other things like look after cattle, feed cattle, maintain fences, keep vegitation under control and so many more jobs. It was the same deal when we re-fenced and needed irrigation, sure we could have done it ourselves with a shovel and taken 3 weeks but the guy with the ditch witch and all the plumbing gear did it in 3 days so the saving isn't just in time but in dollars when you consider we were still free to keep fencing while another job was being done and our time for 3 weeks of digging would have been worth more than the plumbers bill. Remember even the farmer, every business owner in fact, has an hourly rate that it costs him to do any job, it's not like a contractor giving him a bill for time but the time taken still has a dollar figure attached to it.

I don't believe farming has an off season, sure the animals may require less attention in the winter but that is not always the case, we've spent the last two weeks nursing a sick cow in the shed and lifting her twice daily with the tractor to try and get her up and walking again, in the end it was to no avail she died anyway and that's the second cow we've had this winter who needed help (the other one lived). Even if we had a crystal ball we wouldn't have let the cow die 2 weeks ago we'd have spent time nursing her just in case the cyrstal ball was wrong because it's too hard to just let $1500 go down the drain with out putting in the effort, but the one thing we did know full well was that time spent nursing her was time away from getting the old IH tractor back up and running, or finishing the cattle yards. In the two weeks we also had to rush off and fix the landslide and fence which caused the cows injuries in the first place, again taking us away from planned maintenance. Fixing everything, maintianing everything and doing all the work because you are capable of it looks fine on paper but so often has a way of backfiring because farms don't run off paper and many unforseen things can happen on even the most organised farm. There is nothing saying a farmer can't do every job but time management, cash management and even common sense has to be factored into the entire situation and simply saying "I can do it so I will because of the money I save" may be false economy.

 

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Thu, 08/16/2012 - 15:28 #25
supremo
Last seen: 03/08/2018 - 21:05
Joined: 08/12/2012 - 15:41

Thx farmed out nothing is every easy. (ahh the shift key on the left had side on my computter doesnt work.) any way sorry you lost a cow and great to got one better. Id love to know what was the problem with both . I have heard the key to getting cows better is to get them out, i suppose i will have to learn all this. What breed or breeds do you have and what do you recomend. I went to the packenham markets on tuesday and 3 male baby jersey cow went for 16 dollars each my wife and kid would have loved them  he he he ..I assume you would sell them @18 months for 600 would that be right or as bull for more latter?what do male male fresias sell for @ 1.8 months. as a ball park figure. cheers

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Thu, 08/16/2012 - 16:09 #26
Farmed-Out
Last seen: 05/27/2013 - 10:55
Joined: 03/12/2012 - 09:44

Man I must be bored lately, I've posted more times in this thread than I have on the whole forum maybe I should work more :)

I sell computers too, I could do you a good deal on a new one :) Only kidding I'm not advertising :)

First cow dropped when birthing and didn't want to get back up, the vet kept telling us nothing was phsycially wrong so we pampered her for a week or two, lifted her every day and eventually she got better. As near as we can tell the second one rode a land slip down about 30 meters onto the road and took the barb wire fence with it, the signs were never good but as I said before we couldn't just let her go without a fight.

I don't recommend anything to be honest, as a computer salesman for nearly 20 years I realised a long time ago if I suggested something and someone took it as gospel and it didn't work they'd be forever bitchy with me. For that reason I will tell people what I have but never suggest that's what they should have. We currently have several breeds on our farms, one farm is all red angus and we use them for breeding stock, one farm is a mix of black and red angus which are either the weeners from the breeding farm or animals we've brought from market, one farm is a hobby farm with goats, sheep and long necks (alpacas) which none of us really like, one is for the Highland cattle (Archie and his brood) and the other 3 farms are mixed breeds, runts and thsoe who don't play well with others.

We sell ours at different stages it all depends on the cows and the time of year and because ours come from a variety of different stock prices are not cut and dried for each animal. We do however range from $600 for the lesser quality or sometimes "not suited to our farm" cows up to over $1500 for a big bull. We sold one red angus bull last year for $2300 but he was a one off and we've had offers of over $3000 for Archie but he's not for sale.

 

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Thu, 08/16/2012 - 19:15 #27
supremo
Last seen: 03/08/2018 - 21:05
Joined: 08/12/2012 - 15:41

Thx farmed out . i still have the right side shift button but dont like to use it coz i have a habbit tf pressing the enter key instead. As for your veiw or conviction are with me as an opinion and if I hear the same opinion at lease 3 time independantly then ill take more notice of that veiw. It good to see you writting and helping me in establishing many veiw that need to find my own path. what ever is said is, as i said an opinion. some thime the truth of thing get found out by mistakes. iv made alot of those but who hasnt.

how old was the cow or bull was it, that sold for 2,300? how old is that other one that u wont sell? reply when you like.cheers

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Thu, 08/16/2012 - 19:37 #28
Farmed-Out
Last seen: 05/27/2013 - 10:55
Joined: 03/12/2012 - 09:44

I'll give you three different opinions just to make it more interesting....ask me again tomorrow :)

We don't make mistakes, we make adaptions, then those adaptions usually require us to make other adaptions to make whatever it is work. Mistake is such a negative word :)

The bull we offloaded for $2300 had just finished it's 6th season and was getting a bit big for some of our girls so he went off to greener pastures. Archie is about 6 I guess, I can't remember exactly when we started collecting highland cattle with the view to breed them, I'd have to look up the paper work but I think we might have had 4 seasons of calves (and only one set of twins didn't make it) so he's probably older than 4.

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